Wildlife buffs, the next step


#1

So @Macman recently put through a few changes to the wildlife buffs that I think, in general, are a good thing. Some of the health/damage changes are particularly brutal on the hunters more than the monsters, but the reduction in their effectiveness is the main thing that has helped.

That said…I don’t know if for me they’re quite there yet in terms of balance. I have had fights where monsters that are of a similar level still go for that damage buff and benefit hugely from it with very little trade off for getting it. I remember one match in particular this week where we had three domes on the monster with damage reduction and just couldn’t make proper headway because of the duration of the buffs.

If I were to suggest another change to consider it would be to either have buffs last for a lesser amount of time, or at least the big buffs, or to implement something whereby a monster/player’s buffs are cancelled/removed by the falling of a mobile arena.

The former would help ensure that buffs were only useful when used strategically, while the second would look more at ensuring that a monster that is caught (and hunters that catch it) are taking the opportunity to use that buff rather than squandering it since it will be lost as soon as the dome is down. The latter obviously has plenty of complications with regards to taking the trapper out, but I’d argue in this scenario that the monster is strong enough compared to the hunters and doesn’t need their buff, and/or deserves the reward of taking the buff away from the hunters in return.

Just some quick thoughts :smile:


Wildlife buffs, my main issue
#2

Buffs like damage increase will always favor the monster, considering that the monster get 100% of the buff while eatch hunter only get 25%. But some buffs like slowdown and damage resistance are fine.
But the system used to distribute the buffs also favor the monster because a monster can decide to hunt down a buff while the hunters can’t go out of their way to do that.
A complete re-work of the current albino wildlife system would be preferable.

I would also suggest having a vote during the first lobby simular to when you want to change the map, to disable buffs. The monster shouldn’t be allowed to vote, however.


#3

Why can’t Hunters go out of their way for a buff?


#4

I still hate that a monster can completely eat the buff and remove it while I have to camp it ;-; Makes good bait doe :laughing:


#5

Because you’re gifting a free evolution against any monsters at a decent level. I know that when I go hunting I can’t let up the hunt for one second, if I do then the monster will take the break away it is offered, will get the evolve before we can catch it and will then be doing the run and eat game so that it hasn’t suffered for it’s evolution and is armoured up.

Hunters have to follow monsters aggressively in a world where the monster can evolve in 1:30, if they come across a buff in that time then lucky them, but going out of their way really isn’t an option unless they know they need to mitigate a buff the monster has.


#6

Free evolution, but now your whole team deals more damage and remove it for the monster.

Not saying it’s the best idea, mind you.


#7

I’d take catching the monster with no armour over having some damage buff (if we’re lucky that’s what we’ll have) and having to deal with it with full armour, personally :wink:


#8

I think a great/easy solution would be a shorter timer on the buffs. Right now, a trapper’s dome lasts only a minute (iirc). Shorten it to say, a minute and thirty seconds.

What this does is incentivizes the monster to engage in order to maximize its effectiveness, while still not having it linger for an unfair amount of time. Essentially, you get it for ONE battle – so you’d best make the most of it.

Or alternatively, make it so the elite buffs only spawn once/if the monster reaches Stage 3. It then becomes another meta game in of itself. Do we go for damage buff or resistance? Or… do we try and cut the monster off at health regen (assuming he needs it?). Or as the monster, do I let them track down a buff while go to town on the relay? SO many options there. And most importantly, it becomes fair for both sides!


#9

I’m glad to see that I’m not the only one, who still feels that Wildlife buffs need some additional tweaking. As they stand, buffs favor the Monster.

As a hunter you don’t really have the time to secure a buff, during a Stage 1 or Stage 2 hunt. Your main focus is trapping the Monster. Anytime, devoted to anything else, (e.g. getting eaten by a plant) is potentially a free evolve for the Monster. Taking something down, say as tough as an Tyrant, is pretty much giving the Monster enough clearance for a free evolve without a dome. By Stage 3, you either dome before full armor or use valuable time to setup on the relay. If your team is off picking wild flowers in the forest, it’s pretty much game over.

I could see a few changes that might fix the buffs:

  1. Remove them, or remove (increased dmg, decreased dmg, cooldown/reload, health)
  2. Tone them down once again, so they look more like perks.
  3. Decrease the timer on the best buffs.
  4. Make the constant spawns, random.

#10

It’s a buff, your not supposed to get a tradeoff for it.


#11

Why not? If you and the hunters are the same level then you gaining an ability that will put you over the hunters should require something to be risked to get it IMO. I’m not saying the tradeoff should exist while the buff is active.


#12

Just last night I played a few games where the difference between a win and a loss was decided by which team had a buff.

I still want to see them totally gone, but I agree that a good next step would be to reduce the amount of time the buffs are active. When we go 3 domes against a monster with DR or CDR it feels a little ridiculous. Taking their effectiveness down to perk level (and removing the extra health on the animals?) also seems like it could be good.


#13

That is utter bull. If you dont know where the big buffs are at then the monster deserves to get it. While you are hunting the monster and you happen upon a albino kill it. There is no reason to make an excuse “we don’t have the time to look for it”. You have all the time while chasing the monster down and it shouldn’t take your team no more than a few seconds to kill it and move on.


#14

@zind I agree, I played a game yesterday with a Behemoth who was probably our equal, but then he got damage increase buff and it was game over. It’s a shame to see buffs being the reason people win. I’d like to say “Oh he’s got the buff, let’s leave him then, just keep him pressured so he doesn’t evolve until it runs out” but I don’t feel like running around for 5 minutes until the monster notices one of us fall too far behind, or too far ahead, and punishes that mistake.


#15

This happens way too often. I’d love to see dmg+/- and cooldown/reload buffs removed completely. The others don’t bother me as much. They provide a small benefit without turning the table.

I’d also love to see some data on games played with buffs active/secured.


#16

its my opinion too to make more changes on the albinos… it’s still not hard to get a buff (only the movement buff is now mostly harder to kill because it is so fast), too many monster are rushing right after the beginning to the buffs (just watch a few monster player on twitch and you will see it is not hard at all… on med lab they kill right after beginning the movement buff “so the hunter can’t get it”, go down to the DR) and get them. they still last very long… just played against a monster that had the dmg buff during 2 domes, it is no fun at all. it’s a nice idea that main buffs go away after dome is down… but they should spawn everytime on a different place… and its pretty stupid that sometimes the CDR buff spawns directly near the dmg buff (fe on fusion plant)… so the monster can kill both buffs on his way.


#17

This has all been discussed already, but… you just can’t balance a game around the baseline, throw in random advantages and hope it will somehow turn out to be a fun mechanic without any kind of underlying well designed system to obtain these buffs in the first place.

As it is it’s still way too much for way too long and an unfun mechanic all around, simple as that.


#18

The spawn locations should not be static, they should only last for 2 minutes and eating the corpse should not remove the buff. That’s how buffs should work, imo. The current meta is stale.


#19

And if you do know where the big buffs are, the monster still deserves to get them due to its head start and the long timers on buffs.

A buff lasts 1/4 of a match, which is ridiculous.


#20

If alot of the times your losing to buffs the monster gets remove em while hes staging up if you think your team has the capacity to make up for the lost time at stage 2