Why did Evolve Fail?

#1

I guess this topic should go in the game play section but I really want everyone to see it.

What did it all boil down too?
Was Evolve just too unique too far ahead of its time? Did it deviate from what could be considered “normal” games too much and that was what garnered it such a small player base?

Or perhaps it was the game play or balance or lack of?
People complain about balance all the time in so many other games, so even if you thought Kraken was OP that couldn’t have been the root of the cause.

Perhaps it was due to TRS deal with 2K, I mean it was 2K that pulled the plug not turtle rock.

I dont know if anyone else agees, but the game seemed to start losing steam or progess of growth as you could say when they started making the Adaptation Skins

I think this was a critical turning point, because of the rational. TRS wanted to bring the players more fun things to play with without having to invest as much time an energy. While this does seem like a good idea first it falls into the problem of quantity over quality.

If u have peeps working on all these adaptations, that takes away from the next tier.

In this case LoL did the opposite and it makes since. They INCREASED the amount of time between content releases. But they also massively increased the QUALITY of what they released. Dont get me wrong the Adaptations were cool and they were quality, but they weren’t a new tier and having all that new stuff in the next tier might have been a better investment.

If the Adaptations were where the fall off of Evolve began, it was just a symptom then. TRS reacting to a lack or fall off of player base and that has roots else where.

The GAMEPLAY
Now I loved Evolves unique gameplay, but the way it was set up could lead to some unsatisfying themes. There are ways this could have been remedied.

Perhaps the monster only has access to evolve to stage 3 once it had killed or significantly damaged 1-3 hunters. There seemed to be situations where they was a lack of combat and that shut some peeps off to the game.

Do you guys have any other ideas, what do you think was the root of the cause?

who else was wishing for Evolve to continue on and see more tiers?

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#2

Because people don’t know a good game when they see one

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#3

A part of me wants to say that they tried too hard to reinvent the wheel when they didn’t need to. Personally, I felt that the game was as good as dead when TU5.0 hit and changed a load of things without really fixing anything that needed fixing. From there up until TU8.0 things got progressively worse.

Then S2 rolled around and basically killed off the console install base (which, up until this point had been the bigger install base) and while it did fix a lot they made 3 particularly glaring mistakes which lead to the conclusion we’re all familiar with. (bear in mind that I’m looking at this from a business standpoint right now.)

  1. The minrotransactions were not ready for the launch of S2.
  2. When the microtransactions finally were ready they were only ready for a single region rather than all regions.
  3. The weekend event that multiplied any and all earned in-game currency by 10.
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#4

I think the microtransations not being available at first was overall a good thing. If Evolve made a come back with microtransations ready at (re-)launch then the internet would have probably had a field day tearing it a new one. All the cosmetic stuff was 1 of the big things the bandwagons hated back in 2015.

I’m sure from a financial / ‘make 2K interested in funding Evolve’ perspective this didn’t help since Stage 2 didn’t really make much money. But the goodwill generated from being completely free at first hopefully helped out more.

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#5

See, now I want to say that the whole game would have still been completely free, it would have just been a matter of time investment as opposed to financial investment on the part of the players. But then I think back to the whole needless shitstorm that happened over the cosmetic stuff and remember that the people of the internets don’t use common sense.

EDIT: Thinking about it, perhaps I should have said “it took too long for the microtransactions to be made ready in-game.” or something, instead.

1 Like
#6

I wouldn’t really say it was a bad thing not to include any microtransactions, but there was a moment people were buying legacy keys for evolve just to be able to get the founder’s pack and starting hunters and monsters.

If they had merely included a 10$ upgrade to legacy version, I’m sure many would have bought it and perhaps it would have made a bit more money to keep the game funded.

By the time microtransactions were introduced, it was end of August and the playerbase was by then already significantly lower.

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#7

Fail is the wrong word IMO. Financially it did what it needed to do for the publisher and for TRS. TRS also had a vision of theirs realised and committed to for 2 years. Sometimes art and entertainment doesn’t realise mass appeal status, and that’s ok.

That said, there have been a number of threads where people have picked through the bones of TRS’ time on Evolve and while I can’t find the links readily right now if I get the time I’ll link some of them here so you can have a read back on what everyone said when 2K ended TRS’ contract. You’ll certainly be unlikely to find any new views here :slight_smile:

I’ve moved this in to the Evolve section of the forum, just FYI in case you were wondering what the notification might be!

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#8

Legacy flopped because the game had a brutal learning curve, and the DLC provided a convenient scapegoat to hate on the game.

S2 did not fail. 2K made a nonsensical decision and pulled the plug on its development to cover their asses over what happened to 2K Australia, even though they could have easily made a shitton of moolah from people buying keys once microtransactions were added even if TRS stayed on the project.

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#9

TRS weren’t giving the time to iron out the issues, also no web adverts

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#10

People want games what are easy to learn. They didn’t have patience to learn the game. Once a decent monster stomps random hunters they get the bad experience and see it unbalanced. Some again just fall in love with the whole idea of the game, like I did. I was shit in the beginning. But kept playing alone for a long time. I can say that I made real Evolve friend on Stage 2, not in legacy. The whole TRS wasn’t doing enough. They did pretty well in my opinion. Close minded reviewers gave the game a bad rep and a lot of people read reviews before trying to game out themselfs. People tend to like shit games with no brain. Sorry. But I don’t understand what happened after the game went f2p. The numbers just drop.

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#11
  • Adjusting balance around the group of people that complained enough, while most of them, that complained, just stopped playing instead of learning the basics of he game. (Like auto dropship on incap. New people never really understood, that holding B would send them into the dropship)
  • 10x XP weekend.
  • Removing punishment for people that leave the lobby, when they don’t get their spot (this was something I never understood)

Legacy was awsome 100/10

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#12

Evolve never took off like wed have like to have seen, because it proved too frustrating for the majority of players.

I believe the majority of matches were 1 side rofl stomps. Monsters beating the hunters briskly without losing much HP, or the monster losing struggling to gain even a single strike.

Evolve suffered heavily from a perception of balance amongst its players. Theres numerous reasons for this- High skill floors, high skill ceilings, and steep learning curves.

Monsters had a notably lower skill floor to step on to versus hunters. And their lack of reliance on coordination meant a semi decent monster player, could get decent quickly, and wreck most pub-level hunters not communicating in a team.

Matches could swing from one side being well on top- to straight up losing in a moment.

This made evolve frustrating for the majorit of players. Another nail in the coffin was evolves lack of moments of instant satisfaction many other games in the genre have. Cod, Bf, Cs, Ow, etc- With common knowledge from similar games in the genre you can join, and probably have some fun from the get go. Sure you might not be esl 1337 mad pro, but you can pop the corner, get some kills on someone before they react, and have some fun that first match- “Whee im getting killz!”. Evolve lacked this- You either won, or lost, often quite hard. You didnt get the satisfaction of “killing a few monsters, but losing the match overall”.

Its also just natural human psyche- Its quite discerning losing to a single human when you have a team with you. Its offputting losing against a team when youre just by yourself. Its lose lose.

Stage 2 sought to correct many of these, but maybe didnt go far enough. I still think evolves largest issue overall was its perception of balance. These forums were littered with people whining this was OP, that was UP- etc. They were a daily thing. We all heard it NON stop when we played. Player a would chime in “Oh god, they picked THAT monster? That is SO op!!!”, or monster with all chat “You picked THAT hunter? Only NUBS play that OP hunter!” “Whatre you going to do when they NERF that character?” etc.

I think Evolve needed something to mask this perception of balance and encourage (if not damn near force) the matches to be “closer” in the end- While still ensuring that the player(s) that SHOULD have won, ultimately would.

Look at core design in overwatch, for example. Quite often on attack or payload maps, the “defending” team has to run across the map to the point that is amazingly close to the “attacking” side. This ensures that when the attacking side gets any kills at the initial objectives, the defending side has long reinforcement times. Short of a HUGE gap in skill, this ensures that SOME progress will be made by the attacking side. Theyll get to the next point, or theyll move the payload, or… etc. As the game “nears to an end”, the spawn locations are close and closer to being even- Often ensuring the side that SHOULD win, will win, while still allowing the “Weaker side” to make, what feels to THEM, a lot of progress.

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#13

This. Most people were too lazy to try and hunt something down instead of charge toward it and start shooting like it’s COD. If something’s not COD or BF, then most likely people are going to complain until it is.

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#14

The issue was always that the game failed to capture a casual audience.

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#15

In my opinion, the biggest thing was that it always felt like a chase, not a hunt.
The game, for me, was at its best at launch. That’s not to say the DLC character’s aren’t good, just the general state of the game was better to me then.
Some things I would have had different, since the game’s first launch, are:

  • Procedural map generation

  • Forcing (heavily encouraging) encounters through objectives, rather than punishing mobility

  • No adaption characters (as cool as they are, I’d prefer totally new characters, though I can see why TRS chose to make them)

And I’d probably have waited with the DLC and fleshed out the base game first. It gave the game a bad reputation at launch, and a game should be able to stay interesting without needing constant new content.

I can only hope a better start for the sequel, if there ever is one. Looking back, the game was kind of doomed since launch.

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#16

It did not fail!!! It was a blast! I personally loved every minute of it. I loved how it evolved, even when it wasn’t In the way we all wanted it to! I still find my self playing legacy from time to time. Just to remember the thrill of the hunt. But from my perspective selling it as a “Competitive Game” might have attributed to it’s downfall. Never hear anybody say that but it is how I see it! Still will love it till the day I die! I am still a Recovering Evolvaholic. :slight_smile:

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#17

the lack of in game purchases in stage 2 was why 2k killed evolve. When TRS added them it was too late. If evolve 2/3 comes out I’m buying it no matter what.

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#18

I think the primary reason was (and I’m sure it’s been stated) was that the game was actually hard lol. Like if you were a bad monster there was little to no chance of getting better against real people cause when you get caught and killed in less than a minute it’s hard to learn from that. The curve of learning be steepz.

Now stage 2 being shut down was just nonsense

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#19

To reinforce Sidewaysgts point I’d say that for the vast majority of players trying the game Evolve was like those matches on LoL/Dota/Overwatch or whatever where you feel like getting out of the spawn base is pointless and you are just wishing to surrender or that the match gets over with. The other times it was when you feel like you can’t even find people to kill and are secretly hoping your team goofs a bit so you can have some fun and suddenly the game is over already.
This. Was. Every. Game.
On most games the nature of how the formula works it naturally corrects itself. FPS and MOBA games had a great deal of time playing with a lesser degree of assymetry. Evolve would need a ton of inovation in terms of balancing. It was a unique game formula and at the same time this is it’s greatest strengh it was also the biggest trouble as TRS had to find out how to deal with this for the first time in the game industry it was a battle for groundbreaking inovation against a clock that was essentially how long the game could stand while unfortunetely people’s willingness to suffer though it can last.

It was a perfect storm situation. though. I could spend hours and I have done in the past with friends IRL (too lazy to write it) how many things stacked up against the game. From the very problematic launch 2K is heavily responsible for with terrible marketing, prices and DLC annoucements pefore the game was near launch to how much work it needed on Stage 2 when TRS was operating with their core team not nearly enough to implement changes needed at the pace needed. The game was built with a bunch of supporting additional members from other studios and then 2K let them have their second shot without any more financial commitment (there wasn’t even marketing from the publisher side on stage2)

A bunch of crucial stuff that was sorely needed so the public could enjoy Stage 2 began being developed/fixed after the S2 Beta launch and that was when most people made their impression.
I remember a friend of mine telling me how inexcusable it was for Evolve to not have a good matchmaking service and ranked system when I realized the original Evolve launch was actually so long ago only a few games had the robust ranking and MMR systems we consider standard now.
But this is already getting into specifcs about the perfect storm I said I wouldn’t try detailing because it would take too long :stuck_out_tongue:

What we can be sure, though, is whatever they are creating next is probably as deserving of attention as Evolve was and still is, because so far their brief history is only composed of brilliant games and we should still see many more nice gems along this ride with them. :^)

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#20

I think as well it’s worth remembering that those of us here are probably some of the more dedicated Evolve fans, and our view is slightly skewed… or some of our views anyway.

I continue to see a lot of hatred for the idea that people wanted the game to be easier. I don’t think that as a community, of loyal fans, we’ve quite got our head around the fact that the game’s enjoyment level, for a long period of time, was dictated by just one player who also happened to get stronger the longer they kept that fun quota down for the rest of the players.

Wraith was the largest problem Evolve had, even if it is undeniably true that “good” players could deal with wraiths easily, average to good wraith players made the game tedious for the casual audience.

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