TU 09 monster concerns and the new dome system


#1

So my concern is that after TU 09 sneaking will no longer be viable, since with the new dome system where anyone can deploy it, hunters can just spread out, trap the monster in a dome and run around until the rest of the team arrives, this will be fatal on stage 1. Then there is the ability of the trappers that was talked about in the video, where they will be able to ping the monster’s general location, and according to the person talking about it, it will show up for every hunter too. Sooo how can/will they balance this so that monsters can actually sneak around until they reach the later stages?(since the hunters spread out more and with the ping, larger maps will not help)

The new monster armour system where you can regen your armour even in domes, sounds nice and all, but there is a large drawback, which is you will have to stand still and not take any damage, And once the hunters spread out and surround you within a dome, you basically can’t use it. How can/will they balance this?

So until now the only good monster buffs that they’ve teased, are the +1 ability point and the slightly increased movement speed, everything else seem like hunter buffs and monster nerfs.

I can only hope that the final update will be actually balanced, but right now it doesn’t look like it will be.


#2

Slightly increased movement speed can make all the difference for a monster.


#3

False. Same amount of ability points.


#4

These are all good things

You will no longer see entire matches where the monster has been able to stealth the entire match while the hunters spend 4/5s of the time on the wrong side of the map and uh oh hes stage 3 time to hunker down at the relay.

The general response ive seen is “well git gud, learn to hunt! this doesnt happen with good hunters anyways!”- Which is, lets be honest- pretty true. GOOD hunters *do generally know where the monster is most of the time and rarely actually “lose” the monster- they might not know EXACTLY where it is, but they tend to know the general location- So there wont be a huge difference here. Instead well have a game where this is true at ALL levels of play. This is a good thing.

The “perks” of stealthing will now benefit you in bursts, not for extended periods of time. Help ensure you can break away to gain a hefty chunk of your evolve meter, not break away and get your entire evolve meter.

Also bear in mind that monsters will no longer have an out-of combat stamina penalty. Youll basically have combat-stamina anywhere and everywhere. Double the leaps, double the warps, twice the roll-regeneration, etc. Youll have plenty of opportunity to break LoS, shake the hunters, begin sneaking, and work on your evolving.

Yes all the hunters will now get a chance to dome you- Meaning you WILL have to fight. But why dont you WANT to do this now? Because with the current balance of the game- Youre pretty helpless at stage 1, and still arguably on the “weak” side at stage two (Unless youre kraken or elder kraken)- Meaning its generally a BAD idea to fight the hunters without good reason.

THIS is being changed. Monsters are getting massive combat buffs across the board. Stage 1 monsters will have 4 points now, meaning youll get to have all 4 abilities, or a couple of buffed up abilities. Which are themselves, being massively buffed as well. A 1 point leap smash with goliath will have about the same radius of a current 3 point leap smash- And be off cool down more frequently. 1 point rocks will be as big as 3 point rocks, with most of the damage being moved to the burst- So even if you miss the direct rock, that explosion is going to hurt, a lot, not just do a shmezly half damage.

A huge point of evolve is back and forth- Trading hp for strikes. In evolve as it currently is, for a LOT of player levels, this isnt what happens. One side tends to stomp on the other. Even at the high level, this is what we see a lot. Either the monster struggles to get a single down and eats a lot of HP damage, or (s)he obliterates the hunters because someone made a single mistake, and is getting downs/kills long before theyve even broken through the armor.

THIS is what theyre changing, monsters are more threatening, youll get strikes- but at the flip side itll cost you health. This is how its supposed to be.


#5

At the end, remember you start with 4 now instead of three.

As for OP, sneaking will still be valid, and if they spread out and someone domes you, they are by themselves against you. Sounds like a recipe for an easy down to me.


#6

thanks for this lengthy post. Very insightful. cant wait for the update to drop.


#7

I don’t see a version of this game where completely splitting up doesn’t have at least a moderate amount of risk, and sneaking will be more like a quick juke instead of flee til three.


#8

Isn’t there a thread for this already?
@Buckets_Sentry_Gun
@TheMountainThatRoars
@MaddCow


#9

The Trapper’s ping only highlights the general direction that you are at during the time it pings you. It doesn’t follow you as soon as you move. So you can sneak away or hide out of sight.

And any Hunters that domes you alone, is a Hunter with a death wish. :skull_crossbones:


#10

The devs have already said that sneaking won’t be useless…


#11

This. On point once more. :wink:

note to myself: read more of sideways’ posts.


#12

And how will this change in the next update?

Out of combat stamina is all well and good but remember that you have to get away from the hunters first(out of combat).

the ability point is also well and good but if you get domed at stage 1 against 4 hunters how will that help you? Sure you can do slightly more damage, but in the end you are still stage 1.
Btw where did you get those ability buff statistics (tu 9 lv1 rock throw = current lvl 3 rock throw). I can’t find it, can you please point me at the thread thx(all i found was how the new level up system will work)? If it is true then, yes, fighting in domes will be more viable, and feel free to ignore my comment on being trapped on stage one.

Also if a hunter domes you at a hilly area and starts running around using the hills for cover until the other hunters arrive you may not be able to kill him in time, if at all.

Anyways i hope that you will be right in the end and tu9 will be well balanced. Also some good info in your post thx, also i can see why they’re doing it, my concern is merely about the balance.


#13

To be honest here, not being able to have shitty Monster players sneak the entire match is exciting me! I’m all for the new Doming system, and although I’m not crazy about the Support changes, that’s a whole other story entirely.

Needless to say, when I was against players in Quick Play, or sometimes even Ranked, they would start to sneak the moment we dropped from the ship, and do so the entire Match. There was nothing more frustrating than having a Monster think they’re extremely cute and clever by sneaking around the whole Match! This would happen the entire time, often disbanding my team and having people quit. Monsters depending on sneak was getting old.

The new domes will be nice, too, because bad Trappers often strayed away from the group or camped at the Relay, ending up in rage messages and, again, groups disbanding. And when there are no domes to trap the Monster with, it is extremely hard to encourage the Monster to fight, even if you are one member short.

Also, bad Trappers fling domes about the map, not even considering if the Monster had used its traversals to get a good distance away, especially if they were on the corners of the dome to begin with. And afterwards, they didn’t even take the domes down, leaving the Monster a 30-second window to get across the map and get down to sneak again and leave us clueless. Again, step 1, and then Hunters leave again.

So if the sneaking part of Evolve is cut down, I can say that I’ll be exceptionally pleased, as new players depended upon it in order to succeed. And even with good Hunter teams, losing this won’t be very different as they would likely always know where the Monster is on the map. So, sneaking isn’t getting any tears from me.

Monsters will also have better movement speed and strength, as well as 4 starting ability points, so they can cope better with the new changes as well. This is very nice, considering that Monsters like Behemoth or Kraken were rather slow and cumbersome, unable to avoid even the shittiest Trapper’s dome-throws.

Also, this would stop that back-and-forth, running free feel to Evolve that has withdrawn some players. I hated the comments on YouTube videos or other places that stated Evolve was a “running simulator…” Well, my only counter to that is “git gud.”

It’s almost as if people these days expect games to hold their hand the whole way through.

Regardless, this is helping the sneaking Monster thing that has been going around, and with everyone being able to dome, will hopefully prevent Monsters from just creeping about and making the game boring for everyone. Although dome-fights weren’t what made the game fun, it sure will satisfy me that sneaky Monsters aren’t getting what they want anymore!


#14

If you get domed at stage one at any point wether it be from any point in the past until any point in the future, your gona have a bad time.
So that whole point there that you made is completely unviable as a point of argument.
Its exactly like that right now. So if you cant dodge the hunters until stage 2 then thats on you.
Yeah sometimes you get those broken hunter comps but at that point your eff’d anyways.


#15

Where did you see that ?


#16

As far as I know, he is referring to the stamina regen change in TU09.

Stamina will recharge at the same speed while in and out of combat and will regen at a pace in between the two speeds.

For example, Goliath currently regens leaps once every 30 seconds while out of combat but once every 10ish(I forgot the exact number) seconds in combat. In TU09, Goliath will always regen stamina once every 15 seconds.

Devs haven’t every confirmed a movement speed buff, only an SI buff out of combat which will make a huge impact on a monster’s ability to escape the hunters once the dome drops.


#17

I wonder if @mizx may be able to find stats on how many incaps happen per dome at monster stage one for the play testing? And how many stage 1 domes are landed? Might help clear up some of this worry if he has time


#18

Here’s a couple I quickly grabbed with what @niaccurshi inquired with:
Note: All skill levels, for both Live and TRS Playtests.

Average Stage 1 Domes - More domes! Yay! :sunglasses:
LIVE: 1.39 Domes per Game
TRS PLAYTESTS: 1.55 Domes per Game

Average Hunter Incaps - Less Hunter incaps :open_mouth:
(Monster Stage 1 Domes)
LIVE: .71 Incaps per Dome
LIVE (Rank 40 only): .28 Incaps per Dome
TRS PLAYTESTS: .63 Incaps per Dome

Average Monster Health Lost - But half the Monster HP lost per dome! :sparkling_heart: :monster:
(Monster Stage 1 Domes)
LIVE: 2,441 HP Lost Per Dome
TRS PLAYTESTS: 1,264 HP Lost Per Dome


#19

Stat man delivers.

edit: Though I’m not sure that the number of incaps being lower for the TRS play test is necessarily a sign of being harder to incap since live includes a lot of new peeps right now. That change in health lost is significant though


#20

That hunter incap stat shocked me too. In my playtests I feel like there are more incaps overall for the hunter side in domes compared to live. Though it does include all skill levels, so I wouldn’t be surprised if newer players are getting incapped more versus more experienced players who get less. The monster health stat didn’t surprise me one bit though :wink: