Too many random circumstances to be a competetive/ E-sports title?


#1

I was thinking: Maybe Evolve has too many random things and events for it to be a true competetive and E-sports game? I know that League of Legends and Dota 2 get away with things like random critical hits etc. But Evolve has so much more than that.

Think about it. Let’s take lucky monster A and unlucky hunter team B for example:

A match starts, Monster A does his usual sneaking and leaping to create distance. Then he runs into four canyon striders, one of them an elite. A great start for the monster, arguable the best. Oh and on top of that, a snow-storm kicks in. Another advantage for the monster. And so he continues by finding good sources of food, without triggering the random carion birds that can spawn if you eat the wildlife.

The match ends, doesn’t matter who won. The sides change and now one of the players from team B is the monster.

Same map. Yet he doesn’t run into a nice pack of canyon striders or anything. Just a lonely Reaver or Dune Beetles/Mega mouths for him at the start. He finally get his first meat and TADA! Carrion birds and a trapjaw pack to ruin his day. Not to mention that it’s clear sky in this round as well.

Of course this is a best vs worst example, but what do you guys think?


#2

I feel Evolve would be great as an E-sports title. Sure the things you described can happen, but I feel things like that wouldn’t ruin it becoming an E-sports title. After all, Evolve is a really competitive game that I feel would really fit well as an E-sports title.

The amount of cooperation and teamwork that is required as the hunters to take down the monster is critical to winning a match.


#3

Luck is removed when you do best of 3 or (even better) best of 5 scenarios.

One match never tells you anything about skill, it’s always who can stand the test of time.


#4

I think that countering that type of randomness is the job of the tournament organizers, Setting up a format where one or two luck rounds are not as likely to sway the final results. Of course there is also the question of modability and game modes to consider, just because Hunt is the gameplay mode we have been seeing so much of does not mean it is the best suited to e-sports level competitive play, and if early elite wildlife and weather is just too big of a sway factor I bet some smart modder out there could make it so elite wildlife/weather/birds does not even spawn in until monster hits evolve level two or after X time and that mode could be used as the tournament standard, again a decision for the tourney organizers. Of course it is always better if no mods or wild rule sets are needed, but if you were to look at something like smash bros (a game where the tourney rules are based around removing massive amounts of randomness), and compare its normal play to its tourney play they might as well be two different games… I doubt Evolve needs such extensive modification so no it is probably not too random to be a competitve/ E-sports title.


#5

See, even with all this stuff, if you set up the tournaments correctly, the randomness could be mitigated. If you ran a round robin tournament (everyone plays X number of games, points are awarded for various reasons, highest point total wins), then the sheer number of games would prevent randomness from ruining anyone’s chances.

On the flip side, TR could set their game up such that, for tournaments, whatever map setup was present on the first game, is present for all games. They could artificially take out the randomness for people who play for money. During the E3 tournament, both sides played the same map, and all the monsters and buff locations and weather were the same, so they might already be implementing this.


#6

Having played in the alpha, I got to see to some extent how these random affects do and do not really affect gameplay. Yeah getting a bad start finding lots of food is rough, but not nearly as much as you would think. I found that times I started with the meat farther away, I frequently did better because then there were fewer carcasses for hunters to find, and I gained greater distance at the start. I feel that all the random effects from weather, birds, elites, etc can be overcome by skill. There are some powerful buffs like the health regeneration that can definitely sway a game one way or the other, but if a game doesn’t have some fortune in it what is the fun in that? Like when I play Nexus Wars in starcraft 2… I use the same exact strat every single time just because nothing stops me or forces me to play a different way. I feel like randomness is what truly shows real skill. Just my opinion though


#7

I believe competitive wise - Hunters are always going to win. Professional players will simply track down Monster, that’s just my thoughts.


#8

I agree here. Towards the end of the Alpha, I started just skipping over the first few jungle camps and just working on gaining distance. Worked phenomenally well.


#9

If they were serious about turning this into an e-sport, they’d probably include the option to toggle weather as that’s a very valid point. The birds themselves I never found to be a huge disadvantage as they seem more to keep you on the move rather than feeding continuously in one spot. The perks themselves can definitely build momentum but as others have said, will not win you a game by themselves. The events you’ve listed will not win or lose you a game by themselves, but your reactions or lack thereof might.


#10

Nothing to add, except maybe it also brings more fun to watch !


#11

If you watch the dev’s play then you would think different, the TRS dev’s play the game A LOT. I watched a dev match in the Alpha (I was sitting right behind some of them) and it was a battle.

The world is so open there are at MINIMUM 3 directions you can go. You cannot split up 3 ways you will lose, the way they play and experienced players play is by splitting into groups of 2. Medic/Assault + Trapper/Support or (like my team does) Trapper/Medic + Assault/Support., the meta will forever change in this game though which is why I love it. So much strategy so much META ermahgad :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :smile:

A lot of my competitive friends have mixed feelings about Evolve as an E Sport but those who have played it believe it can become something amazing and I will do everything I can do so; been competing in FPS’s for over 10 years.


#12

I agree to a point ; I think without a certain element of randomness a game stagnates but randomness is not the only avenue for truly displaying skill. I mean take a look at chess It has not got an ounce of randomness, but for some folks a well played match of chess is like a work of art and nobody can doubt the skill of a grandmaster. That said for most viewers it is not particularly engaging. An element of randomness In a game like Evolve however is welcome. The way players react to the sort of randomness that effects the small decisions they make will allow for more variation and more opportunity to show mastery/skill, rather than having preset openers in a chess like style.


#13

Dynamic weather has always been an issue in competitive play, especially FPS because of how it can change the fate of everything. Tribes Ascend’s map Bella Omega 2.0 had a random sand storm that made it impossible for people to defend against cappers coming in.

I’m on the fence about this, definitely having weather be toggled off for competitive play would make people feel better but who knows - maybe it won’t be that big of a deal. I didn’t find it that big of a deal in the alpha.


#14

Alright then. I’m even more hyped! :smile:


#15

I think the main thing hurting it as a competitive e-sport contender is it being multiplatform.

Dota 2, LoL, CS:GO, are all solely on PC.

It’s somewhat unrealistic to have FPS compete across platforms, as most would give the edge to a mouse and keyboard.

Unless they created some kind of divisions or leagues between which platform you play it on, I don’t think it will happen, unless they just highlight PC.


#16

this is true to a good extent, I’m hoping it takes off for PC though if it doesn’t I’ll be forced to get a console for the first time in 8 years lol

I think PC will be much easier for competitive play just by the fact that it’s easier to form a competitive community. It was really easy for people to sit in the community teamspeak we had set up for Evolve (shameless advertising) and find a good group to play. It won’t be THAT hard to find a good group in console but it won’t be as easy as PC.

Playing with random people on PC wasn’t really that bad though, who knows maybe it’ll be fine for console.


#17

I agree with OP. This will not develop into an E-Sports title but it will be fun to watch videos of.


#18

I just think that for competitions it would be cool if a “team” was four hunters and a monster. I have a feeling that I could be a strongly competitive monster, whereas I may lack a little bit on a team of hunters just because of my “do my own thing” personality when it comes to gaming. Not trying to say I am a poor team player, but if I have an opportunity to either shield my ally from being incapped, I instead say screw it and drop an orbital on his corpse :stuck_out_tongue: usually to great effect. If I could join a “team” as a monster player and just be a pro monster who fights other “teams” hunters I think even I could get really competitive at this game. I really would like to see some competitions once this game gets going just to see if I could have what it takes to be the best :stuck_out_tongue:


#19

teams would consist of 5 players, 1 monster and 4 hunters… :smile:


#20

Is the only reason why you think that because of the random stuff or is there more? I’m just curious as to why people think it can’t be an E sport. I’ve heard a lot of different reasons from people.