Thoughts on making Markov and Hyde more unique, from a Parnell player


#1

This isn’t really a suggestion or a balance commentary, just the product of a brainstorm of how they could feel more, well unique.

Mostly came about from how similar their weapons feel to fire - with my bias as a Parnell player.


Markov


Lightning Gun


Can now be fired at three times its current range, but its battery drains much faster the further away its target is.

Fire up close to maximize battery life, fire at range when needed.


Arc Mines


Shooting Arc Mines with the Lightning Gun detonates them at for a wider and more damaging explosion.

Mines require very precise targeting to be fired on directly, and have enough explosion radius to damage the Monster when they are close enough to arc.



Hyde


Flamethrower


Direct damage reduced, afterburn increased.

Sustained fire will still be useful, but the weapon will be more effective on grazing shots against evasive enemies than that of any other Assault.

Now deals more damage to weakpoints, so Hyde can finally melt faces.


Gas Grenade


Direct damage removed, now applies a 5 second damage over time effect that renews constantly on the Monster if it is in the cloud.

Combined with the Flamethrower change, Hyde will have a strong damage over time debuff focus.


Minigun


No longer requires a reload, fire speed starts lower slowly accelerates the longer it is fired to a cap.

For those times where Hyde is just struggling to get close…and to make it somehow different from the Assault Rifle in function.


#2

I don’t understand how you always completely misattribute problems and try to fix them in the most roundabout, backwards, counterproductive way possible.


#3

Wait, what?

I specifically said this isn’t a real suggestion or balance thread - just brainstormed ideas for alternate designs.


#4

If you’re not going to contribute anything to the discussion then don’t respond or provide a logical arguement if you don’t agree.


#5

I gotta agree with @dunvi the Markov extended lightning gun range and infinite MINIGUN for Hyde are some of the most backward and roundabout ideas I’ve ever heard and I’ve been playing video games almost daily for 20years. No offense intended if you are offended that’s to bad.


#6

I think it is funny that these ideas are coming from a parnell character…

He is arguably the least complicated/unique character xD

I like these ideas… Probably wouldn’t happen, but it would be fun to play them. Maybe in the future if we ever get modding for Evolve?


#7

I wish I could contest that claim, but its true. :disappointed_relieved:

I just don’t know what would make Parnell more interesting without, well, not feeling right.


That’s more or less what I was hoping for, ideas on what would feel fun.


#8

While on the topic of tweaking characters… Does anyone else think Bucket’s missiles should be homing?

Their damage would obviously be reduced, but right now the laser guidance just feels silly and ineffective. The missile travels fast enough that it really only works at LONG ranges, just giving the monster more traversal without dealing significant damage.

I think a slightly larger clip of less damaging, homing rockets would be a much better fit… But that is just my opinion ^_-


#9

The last thing lightning gun needs is increased range. Even with nerfing at range.

You realize you are asking for an arc mine radius and damage increase with this, when they’re already being hit by the nerf bat? It’s also complicated, difficult to communicate in tutorials, and grants no value to the power, it’s a feature for feature’s sake…

Does flamethrower even do any direct damage right now? I’m not sure it does. Flame thrower absolutely should not take take weakpoint damage.

You’ve just completely reversed the point of the gas grenade. Its point is to encourage monsters to move out of the area. By making them continue to take damage after moving, that decreases the incentive. By tying the start of the DOT trigger to re-entry to the cloud, you’re actually encouraging them to wait out the damage entirely instead of moving at all.

The last thing Hyde needs is more DOT. Hyperspecializing leads to weak classes that are easy to shut down and situational.

The minigun never needs to reload anyway, unless you’re playing badly. By reducing the fire rate during the windup, you’re asking to decrease the effective DPS. Windups discourage weapon swapping, which will greatly hurt both flamethrower and toxic grenades too. And also a windup (that again, decreases DPS) is not going to help Hyde with the fact that his minigun struggles because of its lack of effective range, but in fact hurt it worse!


#10

Bucket’s Missiles shouldn’t be homing or else it just takes away a lot of the skill in leading and aiming your shots, the laser guidance works fine. The only problem I have with his missiles is the projectile velocity is pretty damn slow and the reload speed could be buffed to shave off 1 second.


#11

Obviously it wouldn’t be like heat-seeking mega missiles.

Something like the turn rate they have now, maybe a little faster. They need to be shot near the monster to actually home in…

I do agree with the reload times though… Bucket feels like SUCH a slow character… His turrets take time to deploy, missiles and reload is slow AF, and UAV completely roots him in place.


#12

You missed the point of the article. These are just brainstorm ideas, not calls for balance.

Chill out


#13

I actually think the lightning gun sounds cool. Only thing in the list I like.


#14

They do home - on the red laser attached to the gun.

I love aiming them like that.

I could maybe see it reworked to be one big missile or a cluster of smaller ones that would be easier to aim, but I honestly like Bucket’s Missile Launcher as-is.


@dunvi

This wasn’t a real suggestion, but to entertain you with a response:

Lightning Gun - double depletion at double range and so on, probably wouldn’t be a problem. General capacity could take a nerf bat if things got out of hand.

Arc Mines - first thing to get axed would be the bonus damage on shooting them if they turned out to be overpowered. Personally I think the arm time and health nerfs would have been enough, but that is off-topic. Agreed that the complications alone may make the change undesirable. Feature-wise it would extend their danger zone while Markov is nearby - riskier to stand near and clear.

Gas Grenade - Unless the Monster is in the actual process of killing a downed Medic, they never stand in the cloud, and flushing is mostly pointless in a game with many safe spots that can be reached in several seconds. Re-entry was the wrong word, I meant to imply that it would be constantly re-applying. Specializing leads to healthy game variety and more fun - and the basic concept of “Get close to Monster, damage Monster” stays intact.

Minigun - The reload thing is honestly more of a fluff flavor tweak, I don’t think it would have a huge effect. Agreed that discouraging weapon swapping could be un-fun. Mostly intended it for anti-Kraken matches where the other tools are of little use.


#15

how was yr airplane flight


#16

As a monster I really like the lightning gun idea :wink:

Wait for Markov to quickly drain his lighting gun’s battery because he’s at a distance and then focus on him at close range lol


#17

As a general rule I would make sure there aren’t easier targets first.


#18

Markov and Hyde are plenty unique already and both extremely viable right now. Parnell on the other hand lacks that oomph. He’s unique enough, but he might be a lot more viable if his shotgun shots had a tighter spread.


#19

I fail to see how he lacks oomph. His shotgun has nearly double the base damage output of every other weapon in the game (~275 dps, compared to ~150 for flamethrower/ Lightning/ Minigun after 1.3/ rockets). Assault rifle on Markov is 2nd place at around 66% of it’s base power (~190dps).

His shotgun out damages other assault primaries at their max range on stage one goliath, and giving it tighter spread would be devastating to the monster’s ability to counter him.

He is only weak to the wraith in regards to range, but his aoe rockets are perfect for defeating the wraith’s hiding and cloaking, so it balances out.


#20

Personally, I don’t choose Parnell unless I see Val or Laz as the medic (which isn’t very often), because Parnell really needs those weak points to maximize his damage.