(New ideas) Spore equality for everyone


#1

Right now the spore cloud is in a really weird spot. For some players all it does is remove the healthbar and the player name, meaning that the small silouette alone is enough to see and recognise the Hunters. For others, myself and a certain person on the forums, who is famous for hating Slim, included, it removes Hunters completly. No chance of seeing anyone. Sometimes a movement, sometimes a beam to give away a position, but recognising which hunter it is is close to impossible, making a win against Slim almost purely relying on luck, and certainly making it unfun.

There are basicly 2 options to make this equally annoying for everyone:

  1. Everybody sees nothing -> everybody will hate that -> bad change
  2. Everybody can see the clear outlines.
  3. A middleground of 1 and 2: Everybody sees outlines but they are blurry.

Right now in the game, the smell ability highlights hunters through walls in red (or what ever color in a CB-mode). This outline can be seen and used to recognise a certain hunter for both groups (at least I can as a member of the second group). The monster itself has also eyes, while the player himself should be those eyes, the eyes are not equally effective inside a spore cloud. So what I suggest is, to highlight every hunter visible inside a sporecloud in the same outline that smelling does outside a sporecloud. Smelling inside a sporecloud would remove this outline, as it confuses the monster.

Instead of the exact outline of each specific hunter, another suggestion would be to highlight every hunter behind a small blurry red cloud, so that nobody could see which hunter it is but every one could see that there is a hunter that can recieve damage.

The highlighting of course would only happen as long as the Hunter is in clear line of sight, and would not hightlight them when they hide behind a wall.

New ideas

Since the initial ideas weren’t exactly super popular, here are some more:
1. Slim’s Healing Wave
Instead of changing the spores, how about changing the rest of Slim? If you look at Kraken when he uses Aftershock and there is a cloaked Hunter nearby, it will show a discrepancy in the Aftershock effect, giving away the hunters’s position. Slim’s healing wave could do the same, adding another element to the methods to track a hunter. (Btw I am well aware of the majority of the other methods). For this of course the effect of the wave would need to change to a bubble, otherwise the effect is useless when Slim and the other hunters are on different levels of elevation. In fact, it might be already in the game, but happen too rarely to actually make use of it.
In short:

  • Healing wave changed to Bubble
  • If not yet implemented, the bright green Bubble misses pieces where hunters stand
  • Either the frequency of the Bubble or the duration of it showing should increase for it to be an effective tracking method

2. Hunter colors
For those with the problem (not exclusivly colorblind!!!) to see the actual hunter model, the problem is that they cant differentiate the hunters from the environment. But if the hunter colors would be brigther and more colorful, it would maybe be easier to see them. Right now most of it goes into the grey-ish-brown-ish spectrum too much.


#2

Okay so, please don’t stab me, first and foremost.

I agree, but at the same time, as you’ve said in the opening post, for some people they can see, and some just can’t. Unless you mean the monster turns legit blind and needs a cane and glasses o.o

This looks like a direct nerf to Slim- I’d say it’s not a bad thing to nerf him- except it defeats the purpose of his spore cloud launcher.

Once again what if this doesn’t work for people who can’t see the hunters currently? Like some people will be seeing this perfectly and others are like “I CANT SEE ANYTHIIIING” and what not.

I feel like spore cloud is in a- oh wait you already said it, it’s in a weird spot. I feel like it’s never gonna work out for everyone, no matter how they shape it. :S


#3

Thread on spores?

#I’ll be back in 5 hours.


#4

Nope, you come back here and contribute like you’ve contributed to every other thread recently! >:l


#5

Call me ignorant, but I honestly still think that having difficulty against Slim’s Spore Clouds is related to factors more related to small monitor, low framerate, etc.
Either that or trying to apply an incorrect playstyle.

Not trying to turn this into a “How to counter Slim” -thread, but I would love to see how the players who have trouble against Slim are trying to play against him. Some video footage or something.
He’s initially a tough guy to deal with but once you get the hang of it he’s quite easy to kill, especially when you subconsciously got the timing down of when you should and when you shouldn’t smell.
But to whoever is reading up until this part; please read on. I’m not bashing on anyone.


It’s a good thing you explained it a bit at the end there because initially I feared you thought the only purpose of the Spore Clouds is to be confused with other teammates while it’s actually more useful to indeed hide behind obstruction while the Cloud is active.

However, for one I don’t think implementing a LoS-based condition to whether or not the game should apply a red blurry outline to Hunters is a good idea mainly for the sake of reliability and general confusion.
I don’t mean to insult the developers or call them out on what is possible and what isn’t, but it seems unlikely to me that they’ll be able to properly implement a reliable condition check as to whether or not a Hunter is in LoS.

Not to mention it sounds counter-intuitive. Even if the LoS condition worked flawlessly (I doubt it when you add latency) there’s still the problem of this mechanic requiring far too much experience and practice to understand how it works (for the beginning Monster player).

And finally, I’m starting to wonder if maybe you’re accidentally depicting the old Spore Cloud particle effects when you imagine this change implemented in a future patch.
(Note: the below information is based solely on the final suggestion you made of ways to approach this)
With the current Spore Cloud effect, a Hunter shouldn’t really be hard to spot out in the open. There’s no more shitton of dust flying around on your screen.

Which means that the Hunter will either be:
Behind obstruction, in which case your suggestion doesn’t apply.
Or out in the open, in which case he’ll receive a blurry outline that causes him to be confused with his teammates just as when you wouldn’t have tried to smell.

In other words, there’s literally no way your suggestion would actually change anything in the most common scenario of the Spore Cloud’s usage.


#6

I’m on mobile. I cannot contribute like I normally can.


#7

All in all I would say the most frustrating issues with the Spore Clouds (from a developer’s point of view) are:

  • Each player is handicapped completely different than the other.
  • Map design plays a huge role in the Spore Cloud’s effectiveness.
  • Melee oriented Monsters have a much harder time that other Monsters when it comes to manouvering outside the Spore Clouds while still trying to fight effectively.

I’m not sure if there’s really a reliable way to fix it.
I compare this to the commonly discussed problems with Hunt, really:
Stage 3 Monsters are weak. However sometimes Monsters already don’t fight enough.
Buff stage 3 and you’ll get more flee-til-3 players. Force them to fight more and you’ll just end up with Hunters not bothering to hunt and Monsters confused as to how and when they’re supposed to fight the Hunters.

Impasse.


#8

I understand how hard it WAS for people to play against Slim, since viewing hunters within the mess of weather, spore particles and other visual noise such as your own flames, people’s shielding, lennox’s lance all up in your face… it was damn hard.

But the removal of the spore particles basically resolves this as much as can be resolved, and the devs have been very kind to monsters in adding the additional buff to giving a hint of the hunter outline when hit.

I don’t disbelieve that some people still find it very hard to see the hunters in the world, especially at stage 3, but I am not sure if there is anything that can be reasonably done about that without removing the weapon from the game, which I don’t think I’d want to see happen.

Right now the spore cloud, to me, only feels like it detriments monsters when hunters are juking around scenery a lot as it enables them to get lost through breaking line of sight. As I said, I don’t wish to disrespect very real disabilities that people have.

If I were to suggest a solution of any kind it’d be for the devs to apply some kind of in game filter on the hunters from the monster players perspective, essentially to change the contrast/gamma whatever you want to call it of the skins. If monsters are having a hard time seeing hunters as slim now it’s because, IMO, they’re having a hard time seeing hunters without the aid of the smell ability full stop.

So… rather than focus on spore all the time, unfairly, maybe we should look at the general usability of the game outside of using the smell ability for people with poor eyesight or poor rigs?


#9

no need. No one plays Slim anyway.


#10

In a competitive video game, it is okay that some players can recognize and react to things that other players cannot. That is part of the skillgap.


#11

You want to know why? Because he is almost useless against those who still see the hunters but wins already too much against those who can’t see. Buffing him to adapt to the first group of people would completly screw over the others.

It would be a skill gap if it had something to do with skill. It does not. Some people immediatly see the hunters, others never will.

I am sure though :smile: You just need to be creative enough.

From what I can see, other monster players are already playing as if they could see outlines on the hunters. I just punsh wholes into the air hoping there is someone nearby :confused:

Im not that kind of person who stabs people :frowning:


#12

Spores have literally nothing to do with skill.


#13

i dont even notice spore clouds anymore


#14

[quote=“Sepiablitz, post:11, topic:77710, full:true”]

It would be a skill gap if it had something to do with skill. It does not. Some people immediatly see the hunters, others never will.[/quote]
I disagree with that assessment. Being able to “see” the Hunters in the spore cloud is a defined skill.

Sure it does. On Slim’s side, it has to do with aiming correctly and predicting monster movement as to not dedicate too much time with the Spore Cloud gun out.

On the Monster side, it has to do with getting out of Spore clouds, or when not as feasible, recognizing Hunter movements and dealing with them accordingly while within the Spore clouds.


#15

So sight and color contrast are defined skills that can be taught? Why are you sitting on your ass in a video game forum then? There are a ton of colorblind people all around the world that are way too noobish to figure this out.

Go teach all those colorblind people how to see…

with skill


#16

There’s colorblind options now though. o.O


#17

But from my understanding, it doesn’t help against spores.


#18

People still have trouble with the contrast regardless.

Its ridiculous to tell someone they lack skill because of poor contrast in the game and/or trouble with sight in reality


#19

Fair enough, I agree thats kinda ass.

I was told otherwise but can’t speak for this because I’m not colorblind nor do I use the feature.


#20

A couple of my friends use it, they still have problems.