'necessity' of the tranq gun too big to not skip Val?


#1

So yea, pretty much everyone I have spoken to sort of agrees that Val is superior to Lazarus. Not that Lazarus is bad, but because of Val’s tranq gun. Some might even say that if you take everything away from Val except her tranq gun, she would still be incredibly powerful.

What do you guys think? Is the tranq gun SO powerful that you kind of need to take Val, as useful as Lazarus (and Caira) may be?


#2

Lazarus wins my vote every day over Val, with a good trapper you shouldnt need the tranq crutch as much.


#3

(no offense but another medic thread >.<… no love for :trapper: :assault: :support: ? )

Monster can still escape even when tranq’d and lazarus is much better with an experienced team tbh.


#4

I will say that in the many games I played as Goliath, I had a much more annoying time against Lazarus. Eating a hunter is not always possible given the situation so he can be quite a pain. The tranq gun is great and will work wonders with Abe I believe but I don’t think it makes as big of a difference as some might think.


#5

I’ll merge this thread with the other medic one once I have enough posts about it. I’m just curious what people think.


#6

depends on the comp i say. with the third tier having tranqs, slows and traps, you wont need your medic tranqing the monster. so laz is perfectly fine.
my idea of the all out offensive prowess is hyde, abe, laz, bucket or caibot. 2 forms of searching for the monster, two forms of slows and tracking the monster. with caibot u get damage amp. and perm vision to shoot thru walls safely. abe slows and keeps him tracked even longer.


#7

I think every medic has their values, just different values. There are no real necessities for a particular role that isn’t bundled with the role.

Val: you have sustain, tracking/soft control, and slow but significant damage amp.
Lazarus: you have stealth, full revival, and fast but minor damage amp.
Caira: you have sustain, utility buffs, and damage.

It comes down to preference. I’m sure some medic will outclass another in some particular situation, but as far as an overarching sense of usefulness, I see them as equal.


#8

We can always merge them DBZ style :stuck_out_tongue:


#9

The main arguments about the power of the tranq gun are (according to the people that WANT me to play Val on their team):

-The tranq slows the monster enough in the dome so that the team can do sufficient damage to him in that one minute. Without the tranq, the monster can just run around uncontrolled and you will probably not even bring its armor down before the arena runs out.

-Kraken. Need I say more? the tranqs are an absolute MUST vs the kraken. If you don’t have Val, your trapper is forced to take Griffin in order for the team to have something VS a kraken.

-Tranqs slow the monster’s advance towards your teammates, thus reducing the damage they take.

-If the arena is on cooldown/trapper not in position to throw it, constant tranqs allow your team to catch the monster quicker. It also allows them to keep a constant vision over them.

-A slower monster is easier to hit with things like the Orbital Barrage. If the monster isn’t tranq’d, you will never be able to land a barrage.

Now bear in mind that these statements come from the people I often play with in a hunter team. They are 0% open to any other medic than Val because of these points.


#10

I agree that val is more useful at controlling a monster in a dome, but as I see it, a medic’s first priority is healing. It should be your prerogative to play the medic you find best at doing what you intend to do. By picking another medic than val, the trapper may need to pay a bit more attention, at the benefit of being better looked after by you.

In context of the alpha, it could be equally argued that having down penalties is much worse than having a more manageable dome fight. It’s all about preference and what you can do the best with for yourself.

When people assume one character is fundamentally better than another (usually from lack of understanding), that is how a META forms. The best thing to do is prove it wrong!


#11

So the trapper is sitting afk after using the dome? :slight_smile: haha

Yea true but you can also use abe.

The monster can still use abilities and jumps to get away, transq are not that op :smile:

Well yes, a slower object will always be easier to hit. But you can also combo with your trapper and know the monsters movements really well = having skill. :slight_smile:


#12

Trapper’s CC is not enough to stop a monster jumping around in the arena. At least not enough to get a full armor monster down to no armor so you can start doing permanent damage.

Fair enough, Abe might also work. But still, if you don’t have Val, that means a 100% nono for taking Maggie.

And the trapper’s CC (apart from a perfect triangle of harpoon traps from Maggie) is not enough slow/snare towards the monster for the orbital barrage to hit.

Remember, I’m talking a 100% coward monster here: runs away ALL the time, barely stopping to get meats. And when we finally dome him after cutting him off, he just runs around in the arena until the time is up. Without Val, the trapper’s CC is not enough to allow the damage dealers to bring his armor down and start doing damage to him. And when the dome is down, he proceeds to do is 100% optimal fleeing (timing abilties in between leaps etc) so we can spend a long time trying to cut him off again (even with Griffin).


#13

Oh that kind of monster player… yea nothing you can do without val :slight_smile: but you can corner it and do a bit of dmg evry time and hoping you get some health dmg. ( you have to remember that you don’t have to KILL the monster, wasting his time and getting to that 20 min mark is fine aswell ) Had a game where the monster was not even halfway to stage 3 and game was over because of time :slight_smile:


#14

I know but… boring…


#16

Yea but those type of monster players will only be on low level :slight_smile: Most of the monsters will fight.


#17

well regarding the coward monster. look at caibot. if you dome him caibot can shoot through walls and do decent damage.

Kraken vs laz, well Id argue that if your team (premade) struggles with val since kraken is so bursty. you can all out assault and try to match krakens damage blow for blow. paint his body and markovs assault rifle, abe’s single buck shot shotty, and caibots between wall shooting can easily deal significant damage. laz is there with a rezo and dip (hopefully) and you can down a free flying kraken just fine. doenst need to be grounded or slowed.

Edit: dont forget the secondary cc from caibot and abe.


#18

if abe is on your team then val’s tranq are needed anymore


#19

Yikes, it doesn’t fix the problem tought.


#20

players like this will lose in the end vs a good hunter team because they get no down tickets at levels 1-2


#21

Medic is not and should not be the primary form of CC. That duty belongs to the trapper.

Tranq is nice sure. But what are you giving up? AoE heals? Penalty free revives?

It’s up to you to decide if that’s an acceptable cost.