How do you think Sunny could play fairly?


#1

OK, so I’m always seeing: “SUNNY DIE IN A FIRE!!11!!!” everywhere. I mean, I know why. But come on. She can be a real… ah… nuisance in the right hands. But she’s still a support, right?

So I’m wondering: you kids know how bad Sunny can get. If you could change anything about her or think of something that you, as a hunter or monster, would find good as in fun and as in legitimate tactics, what would it be? I mean, I’d like game play discussion, but changing her arsenal directly would be interesting to think about.

I’ve already played with her a bit but not in pubs, just in custom or solo. So I know the basics on how to play her. I’ve read the thread, watched some gameplay, and played a bit myself.

I just want to get some input from people who play as/with/against her. Not trying to incite fighting or whatever, hopefully. I mean, things get heated when she, Laz, or her pal Val enter the room.


#2

Remove the 1.5 times effectiveness.

Or nerf it’s capacity like they are kinda doing (it’s consumption increase but in essence capacity nerf)

Taht way it’s fair-ish.

The extra boost it a real problem if it just gave extra jetpack it would be less of a problem I think.

Or lower capacity so that it gets less boosts.

Or you could make it work instead of requiring 1% to do a full boost, make it work like you get 1% of capacity, you get 1% of a boost (or whatever the equivalent percentage it would cover)


#3

Well, to not annoy the Monster, I avoid boosting on the chase. Makes for a more enjoyable match.

For a legitimate tactic, keeping fairness in mind, I stay further from the fray with good LoS and hit the Monster, occasionally getting closer to replace the Drone. Boosting only when someone is getting heavily focused, and only ever Medic. Keep-away isn’t fun.

For balance changes, I think her Booster should keep the speed, but not the distance (traveled) or capacity. Less distance fast is better than more slow distance. Just my opinion. Shield Drone isn’t really an issue. She can only make use with LoS and 8 seconds, assuming you don’t hit it a couple times before it starts up. I think if it had a startup of 10 seconds, had slightly more capacity, but broke when shields expended, that would be alright, as well.


#4

I find Sunny to be the worst Hunter in the game by far. Her Shield Drone only shields when it feels like it, and sometimes doesn’t shield at all. Her mininuke grenade launcher does far less damage than it feels like it should, and her jetpack booster should work more like Tech Hank’s shield charger. Having to keep constant line of sight to use it, and then it drains completely in a microsecond? She’s so useless.


#5

What? Huh? How? Maybe if I get some sleep I’ll understand better.


#6

Please put "/Kappa’ or “/s” at the end of your posts if you’re going to make posts like this. It helps to avoid unnecessary drama and flame wars with biased posters.

otherwise good work, I had a really fun time reading the post.
:wink:


#7

(Obligatory long post warning. There will be TLDR at the bottom)

Jetpack Booster:

  1. Reduce capacity.
  2. Decrease cooldown proportionally, or near proportionally, allowing her to provide ROUGHLY as many “boosts per minute” as she can now, as a starting point.
  3. ONLY allow sunnys “extra boost” to apply to HORIZONTAL dodges, not vertical ones.

IMO, the biggest problem with Sunnys jet pack booster is how many bases it covers- Combined with the context of not only the rest of her kit (more on this in a moment), but the other hunters. The main thing about her jet pack booster as it is now, is it not only allows her to help her team mates dodge much better, it allows her to completely relocate that hunter within a wide bubble around her.

A horizontal dodge with sunny boost on a flat surface allows you to dodge 20’ish meters away, compared to a standard 12-13’ish. A neutral dodge (straight up), allows you to boost about 16 meters into the air- Instead of the standard 8 (The boost increase may be a straight %, but bear in mind “because physics”, the actual distance you go are NOT directly increased by the same amount, its simply an increase in that momentary “push”, then the force leaves, and you begin to slow down).

So shell help you dodge an ability, and send you clear to the other side of the dome. On flat ground she can move a hunter about 80 meters, WITHOUT them using their own jetpack. Or they can boost 16-32 meters ABOVE the monsters head, and then move 40-60+ meters away from there.

The monster now has an ability on cooldown that probably did no damage. And they cant maintain any melee focus. And have to waste time chasing you to the other side of the dome- Probably at the cost of a traversal. Probably TWO or more if jack/griffin/maggie are there. All while the medic now has a longer time to heal them. All while the assault is blasting away at you. While…

For comparison- how does Hanks mitigation work? Monster hits you, does no damage- Youre still there for them to focus. Medic/trapper had a small window to help you get away/heal you.

These changes are aimed at making her jetpack booster be a tool to help hunters DODGE, not completely up and relocate- By disallowing her the immediate capacity to do this in the first place. Making it only provide a benefit on the horizontal instead of the vertical will again help make sure its being used to dodge abilities. The devs have made efforts to reduce the power of simply up up and awaying from monsters for numerous reasons (varying monster capacity yo deal with this, the frustration of how easily it is to lose track of hunters who superman out of your vision and then off in some random direction, etc)- But sunny effectively bypasses all of these efforts and allows hunters to once again do this. Doing that will keep her kit in line with this mentality.

This will also work on the chase as well- Because again, she can propel someone about 80+ meters forward WITHOUT perks like capacity. Trapper can be 40 meters to her right, and then be 40 meters to her left in a moment, without the trapper needing any resources of their own. Or she can send a couple of people 40+ meters forward each. Or… etc. Again, shed lack the “immediate” capacity required to do this in one swing- and would have to pause/break between.

Shield Drone:

  1. Give it less hp
  2. Increase how long the beam will stay tethered to a hunter after they have taken no damage
  3. Fix it so it doesnt negate half a direct rock. Seriously this shit sucks.

I believe I understand WHY the shield drone HAD more capacity than hanks shield. At first, and on its own, it made sense. Hank players can drop shields between attacks to charge their battery up, and better block big abilities. The drone AI cant, it simply locks onto to someone who is taking damage, and holds it- for every little thing. I believe they were worried about how easily a monster would be able to blow through these shields, and just keep the shield on zero capacity. After all something like a leap/charge, and poof- No more shields.

Thing is.

Sunny has a jet pack booster.

So the moment someone gets focused, even if they take the initial hit, the second hit will be blocked. Then she scoops them up- The 3rd ability misses. And she throws them clear to the other side of the dome.

By the time the monster can catch back up to the hunter they were after, the beam has had enough time to drop, and the shield drone has recharged (And for some reason it recharges faster the second time than the first time, at least last time i checked it did. like 5ish seconds vs 7-8ish seconds. still not sure if this is as bug or intentional). This means the only PRACTICAL way to counter the drone is to basically remove it constantly. Sure you can “hit one person with an ability! then melee someone else to put the beam on them! then go back to the other tar” and oh sunny has whisked away your original target already… I guess in theory you can flame breath someone, and use your other abilities, using the dot to keep the shield going back to the “dummy” target. But youve only a couple second window to do this. And again jet pack booster.

And depending on the monster you are, and which part of your melee cycle youre at- The thing can take 3-4 melees to bring down. Within the context of this game, this is a LONG time. All while each and every single hunter is blasting away at you. Directly at you, since they know exactly where youll be.

Once again enforcing the idea that you HAVE to use an ability to take this thing out, the will be up again in 7-8 seconds. Which basically means that even if it DOESNT shield someone, its done the same job as a shield.

You need more options for the thing, plain and simple. Extending how long it held the beam on a hunter taking damage means even IF they got away, the concept of brute-forcing through the drones capacity would be a practical idea, not a pipe dream. Making it practical to melee the thing means you dont HAVE to cycle abilities to keep it out of play, making it do the job of a shield anyways. You SHOULD take a bit more punishment for “saving abilities” imo- But i think you take too much punishment right now currently.

02 cents.

TLDR: Jet pack booster, reduce capacity, increase recharge rate so she gets roughly the same boosts per dome, but has less immediate relocation capability. Change it so that the “boost” to dodges only work horizontally, not vertically. Give shield drone less hp, extend how long itll tether to someone after theyve had no damage.


#8

I don’t understand. The shield drone already gets destroyed quite easily, and hasn’t its HP already been reduced once before? If anything, I’d rather have it have a slight cool down with a faster setup time than have it shred like paper.


#9

With abilities.

Not with melees.

It can take a few seconds of melees to remove the thing. Once youre in range of it. But youll probably have to waste a traversal, or climb to the thing- All while being blasted by the assault. if it takes you 3 seconds to get to it, and 3 seconds to down it, that 10% of the dome youve spent dealing with 1 drone. In those 6 seconds a decent hyde will easily have done 1000 damage. Griffin will have done 900 on his own. If sunny is un pressured, shell have done another 350 on top of this.

This is why you dont see monsters melee the thing down, and instead use abilities.

The HP was dropped from launch hp because it could literally take more than 1 ability to down. Which was asinine. That was a step in the right direction, but to many, not enough. I dont think they should shred like klenex, but at the same time i feel currently you take too much punishment for making the decision to melee it. Im fine with that decision being “punished”, just not to the extent that it currently is.

It just needs more viable “counters” IMO. Counters dont need to mean “freebies”, it needs to be fair for BOTH sides, but as it is- you basically only have 1 option. And it kind of sucks most times.

And in practicality what will this solve?

The drone already has a cooldown time. The drone, once deployed, wont shield until its reached full charge for the first time. This IS a cooldown period. I cant recall the specifics, but it takes about 7-8 seconds after deployment to be functional.

I want to point out that all of my input comes from someone who is first and foremost, a sunny main. Or used to be- Ive stopped using her in anyhing but “try hard mode” because I know how frustrating she can be to play against. I was near the top of the global sunnys on PC before i dropped- But am still near there- And the majority of my time on sunny is spent in customs playing primarily with competitive players, or affiliates. NOT that this makes me good by any stretch (I have a lot i can improve upon), but i do at least like to think im “Experienced” with sunny.

There is a reason sunny has a nearly 100% ban rate in competitions like ESL. I personally believe these are the reasons why.


#10

I’m really not understanding the love for Sunny here. I find her incredibly weak and useless. People actually like her? I think she’s the worst Hunter in the game. I’ll use literally anybody over her.


#11

-Her boost is 4 times op (Trapper is able to find you in seconds, you have no chance to get a way from the hunters, boosting players protect them better than any shield or healing, theres no cd on this abillity)
-the drone is op in shielding and cd (if you destroy it , another is placed and ready within 2 seconds)
-the drone has too much health (needs 4 hits!!! or an lvl2 skill)

all in all a complete retarted and unfair op hunter, but that isnt new for this community :D. All knew it but nothing changed.

You can try to focus her, but she will go invis and even if you chased her down she, will get healed by Val to be up in 2 seconds again. In this time you got so much damage from the rest of the team that it is almost impossible to win.
If you focus the Trapper, he will get boosted and shielded and healed by supp and medic and you wont get him.

TRS we just need a ban system


#12

Boost all day. No matter how much you nerf it or how balanced it gets, good usage will always be frustrating to the monster.


#13

I’m sorry, I REALLY don’t see Sunny as overpowered. Her Shield Drone doesn’t do crap when I play as her. I can have a Hunter right in front of it getting attacked, and it just sits there doing nothing. The Jetpack Booster drains its battery in like half a second, and her Mininuke Grenade Launcher isn’t particularly great; it’s slow to reload, does mediocre damage, and only holds one shot.


#14

Are you fairly new to the game? This isn’t meant as an insult it’s just very well known how powerful she is in high level play and pubs she also gets a lot of play. She is always banned in tournament play if bans are part of the rules. I think you could do with watching some games of her being used by people who know how to use her. It’s silly how broken she is right now.


#15

I don’t have a problem with her.


#16

I’ve been playing this game since day one, and I find her to be by FAR the weakest Hunter in the game. I gave up on even trying to get her Shield Drone and Jetpack Booster to maximum. The Shield Drone just sits there and does nothing.


#17

Then I’m afraid you don’t understand the game that well. People in tournaments don’t ban weak characters.


#19

Most high skilled players will rate Sunny as best Support. Rest high skilled will rate her equal to Hank.

Consequently, if ban-system is in effect Sunny will get close to 100% ban rate


#20

I just don’t see it. I’d definitely consider myself a top level player, and I easily rate her as the worst. MAYBE second worst after Cabot. I’d rather fight a Goliath on my own as Griffin than be stuck with Sunny.


#21

Dude please just think! Always banned in tournament play, plenty of posts on the forums, she’s just had a nerf (albeit a slight one) and is getting another one in the next TU. Has it not crossed your mind that perhaps your interpretation of the game is not the reality for the majority?

There’s nothing wrong with not being fully aware of something. Just look into it and in this case you will very quickly see why she is rated so highly.