How are you supposed to beat a good team?


#1

I really don’t get how it’s possible to beat a functional team.

Yesterday I went up against what I’m 99% confident was a premade, all using Elite characters.

They had Slim, Sunny, Abe and Hyde vs me as Goliath.

Now I don’t clacim to be the best monster player ever or anything but it was just impossible for me to do anything, Abe was constantly boosted up my ass slowing me down with stasis(meaning I had to wait to recover traversal) and darting me and whenever the dome was ready he’d get that up.
Attacking anyone was worthless since the shield drone or spore gun would protect them, if I destroyed the shield drone obviously half a second later another is up anyway.
It was a night map so seeing Slim was stupidly hard and anyone I got even close to half health was boosted away in to the sky.

How are you supposed to beat a team like this? I managed to get enough energy to Evolve but like fuck I’d have the time to stop anywhere and do it safely.

I beat them just before in Defend since Kraken is OP as heck for Defend but if I didn’t get disconnected from the next set of matches they’d have beaten me at least 4 out of 5 matches.

If everyone is doing their job and are in a team a win seems almost impossible, so far as I can see.
(not that Goliath is all that good)


#2

Yep. It’s like this because the game is balanced towards the greater part of the population of the game: the hunter teams running like headless chickens into carnivorous plants.
They need to maintain the 50%'ish global win/lose ratio so that this majority would stay happy, but since this is a 4v1 game with no ranked ladderboards and a great difference between coordinated teams vs uncoordinated teams, balancing tends to be weird.


#3

Watch ESL Goliaths. Helped me.

e.g. http://www.twitch.tv/black_aegis/b/655789244?t=5h9m

Although as far as I know T4 was only allowed just before the tournament, so hunters weren’t really ready to use it well. Next week will probably show their true potential I guess, for better or worse.


#4

well against the abe. sneaking is your best friend. that and DO NOT go towards caves. if you sneak right off the bat. any smart hunters will run towards the nearest cave because thats where you logically will go.

EDIT: another tactic i just remember. leave tracks in a direction and then sneak and keep going the same direction :confused: this works surprisingly well against “good” hunter teams because they will think thats the direction you DIDNT go. i ran into such a situation where a guy assumed where ever the tracks where right off the bat is the wrong direction so i basically got free meals to stage 2 real fast


#5

So you got beaten from a competent hunter team with a mediocre hunter comp. I see nothing wrong here.
Just because they are not walkovers like 99% of pubs, doesn’t mean the game is imbalanced.
From reading your post, i assume you had trouble even getting stage 2 vs abe and a non bursty comp. That is clearly a learn to play issue.
What you should have done:
get full evolve meter before they can find you (this requires you to know how to effectively feed)
get domed at a location with a loop, preferably in one end of the map
avoid as much as possible
if you have armor left at the end of the dome engage them (last 10sec)
make them dodge, use their jetpack, scatter them
but try to have full traversal leap ready when dome drops
use all 3 traversals and leap smash hide at another location with a loop and instantly evolve
they dont have dome yet run (burst your traversals, not one by one) try to get some armor in
wait for an overextend
hit slim, as soon as he get boosted shielded start evading hard
dont get hit by slim, if you dont he got ZERO selfheal
wait cds and go hard on him again
repeat until slim down
???
game won


#6

i wouldnt call it mediocre. now that those damn toxic grenades dont slow you down. hyde is a pretty solid assault

abe is the second best trapper in the game in my opinon

sonnie pre nerf is OP but now that they nerfed the shit out of her jetpack booster not so much

and slim . . . well against a moving monster he sucks

i say its below what can be considered good. but with slims ability to heal everyone even across the map. it makes splitting up viable. strengths and disadvantages and all that jazz


#7

abe is useless, especially versus goliath. and slim is meh. so there are 2 good and 2 not so good picks.
they work together pretty well, i give you that.
its annoying but not a top comp by any means.


#8

I am immediately reminded of the mind games in Smash Bros, for some reason.

“Ha! I knew that you knew that I knew that you knew that I would use Counter, so I spot dodged instead and grabbed you!”


#9

Easy to beat a team on the custom maps I make, wildlife set to average then you see gangs of eight mammoth birds killing everything in existence.


#10

I feel your pain as a goliath main its really hard sometimes but that’s what make it fun. ur sneaking tactics should base off the trapper. Since its abe ( the downside about him is he has to find the monster first) lead false tracks n try to get away as far as possible. the goal is to get to stage 2 and pound sunny or slim. In this comp abe or hyde. not the problem its those spore gun and jb. With premades teams theres always one person who mess up it could be really small u need to take advantage of this. remember everyone has habits they could be use to playing against bad monsters or monsters who wont turn on medic chasing them.


#11

If you do not step up your game, you won’t, they will shred you over and over and it will be frustrating and your only refuge will be custom games or random pubs where you can obliterate unorganized piles of amphibian sh…


#12

agaisnts slim you want to rely on your abilities. get big damage like leap smash or rock throw. do not sit an melee, 1 you cant see shyt. and 2 slim is healing off of your face. slim is next to useless if he has nothing to shoot at.

so land a rock. hide. land another rock with a leap smash follow up. unless there is wildlife. slim cannot heal at all. and sunny’s shield does not block damage from the first hit of a move. also it lasts like 4 seconds. so by the time rock throw is off cd. sunnys shield will turn off lol.

after i figured that out slim comps became way easier but its still a pain in the ass not being able to smell your target.


#13

How is he useless against Goliath? No matter how much I jumped away he’d always just catch me with a stasis grenade since with Elite you get a bigger radius.
And then you’re walking like a snail until you jump again, which is a useless jump with Sunny on the team because Hunters rocket across like half the map in seconds…

Your method of engaging them is kinda useless against the team I fought. Stage 1 Goliath is worthless, getting a strike on anyone is impossible with Sunny boosting them and her shield drone plus Slim’s spore gun. Hiding in the dome is also useless due to tracking darts.
Getting a strike on anyone is ridiculous since I’m guessing they all had health regen or the Medic was insanely good I got a couple of them down to like 30% health at one point, having to evade due to health being ripped in to. Seconds later they were fine.

Also this was on the map where you get a minion if you win as the Monster, I forget what it’s called so Mammoth Birds were everywhere fucking up my health if I landed near them.

The only person who wasn’t much of a threat was Hyde but his role could be played by anyone, except maybe Torvald he’s easy to dodge.


#14

I feel your pain. I’ve totally quit playing monster, despite it being my favorite. It’s absolutely impossible to play unless you’re a competitive level god.

It seems like the Monster has a significantly higher skill ceiling, but they’re also expected to be MUCH better than the Hunters if they want a fair fight. In theory, look at competitive games. Monsters were pulling in wins +20% more often than pubs. So I’m pretty sure there’s a higher skill cap for monsters… It seems like for the monster to stand a chance at all, he needs to massively outskill the Hunters. Even then, his victory likely still hinges on the Hunters making mistakes.

I’m sure if I sat down and only played Monster for another 200 hours, I might be able to land a 50% win ratio against pub hunters. But, I’d be frustrated and hate every minute of it. So fuck that, I’m playing Hunters.


#15

somehow i still find fun out of it. but its not the same careless fun like before. I used to go into fights like its time to brawl bitches! but now i must calculate and plan every encounter lol.

here is a list of how i achieve fun:

  • JUKE CITY. seriously, nothing gets the heart pumping like having a hunter breathing down your neck as you hide. then you make the clean getaway. most recent game i hid behind the goddam food crates on new foundry…I have no goddam idea how they didnt see me i was right in line of sight if i moved an inch they would have seen me!!
  • Epic skill shots. with sunny being sunny. i find great fascination in landing fissure, rockthrow, toungue grab, abduct, and vortex on a jetpack boosted target. gets me pumped.
  • abduct. abduct, and abduct. iv pretty much migrated to a wraith main somehow. i beat good teams despite the forum rants on competitive wraiths. but man one time i timed the jump of a drop ship with a level 3 adbuct. the guy didnt even jump out the ship before being pulled away and dead lololol. it was SICK.
  • Butt clenchers. yup. stressful. but pulling out that win with less than a sliver of hp is super fun win or lose. i had .25 hp left with the wraith. they all had strikes into the stage 3 fight. killed everyone but hank and val. then val did some epic dodges and got hank back up. hank finished me off with some climatic shooting as he died lol.

its funny cuz everytime i defend something, or share something. im always talking about last night. thats right. ALL of this mentioned above happned ONLY last night. in fact it should be all on my twitch channel as proof. that is why i like playing monster.

thank you. lol


#16

Yeah a remade team with the new Hunters is kinda ridiculous. I was lucky it was Abe and not Crow because Gobi can be following you the entire match and there is no escape, you get like a couple of minutes feeding before carrion birds show up and unless you’re in a biiiig map they find you, Gobi finds you. Gobi will not stop until you are lit up or dead.

Plus the rifle, shit’s annoying especially at Stage 1.

I feel like the new Hunters kinda break you chances of winning as a Monster, Sunny and Slim especially in a battle they’re only really weak against big man Behemoth, ironically everything else is too slow.
'cept maybe Wraith but y’know, have fun with nukes at Stage 1 in the dome…


#17

My strategy against premades is to armor up as much as possible and try to avoid that early dome but if they get you, oh well. Try to skirt around the dome and survive without permanent health loss, and also get an idea of their strategy for the next dome. Then escape and find a good place to evolve.

As Goliath with a Sunny, there’s always the possibility that she shoots assault or trapper up way ahead of the rest of the team. Also, I like to use rock and charge to push people away from Sunny’s shield. Slim is pretty worthless too so long as you are moving.

The main thing is premades in pub games tend to be a little too confident, and in my experience a lot of them make mistakes. You gotta capitalize on them. One hunter out of position can swing a good match and be the difference in a win or a loss.


#18

I feel your pain man. Specially because its Goliath. Ppl say he is the most balanced, but i think he is by far the hardest of all monsters to use.


#19

Sneak at the start against Abe and go for the mammoth birds to get to stage 2 as quickly as possible if you can do that and armor up getting domed isn’t so bad, you can always run around it avoiding damage, against good teams you really don’t want to take health damage and want to always get to stage 3 to become stronger making killing team easier, you also have to really take advantage of any mistakes they make, and ya probably focus sunny first then slim, or both if you can


#20

If you’re on xbox one then I think I’ve played them before, if not a similar premade used this comp. I beat them and then they all rage quit :slight_smile: elite goliath too stronk