Even if the “best” Monsters avoid them, it’s the trapper who decides where to fight. There’s diffrent types of elevation everywhere in Evolve, slopes everywhere, but not cover.
I know getting health damage is common, also, where did I write that I said that you said that getting health damage is uncommon? A first engagement can make or break a Monster, but what if the Hunters are the best like the Monster? He’s losing some health damage whether or not he actively engages or “attacking and failing.”
I’m sure I don’t have to tell you that the Trapper can’t dome the Monster anywhere the Monster isn’t.
Areas without somewhere to hide, run around to a different spot, and go hide again are very rare.
You implied that I was saying health damage is uncommon in the “hunters will definitely get some health damage” comment as if I was trying to argue against it.
The first engagement only makes or breaks a game for the Monster if they are either engaging when they shouldn’t or staying in a fight when they should be shifting to evasion.
Both of these scenarios require the Monster to choose to fight.
Even if the Hunters are great, the health damage on an evading Monster is usually minor, in the 1-2 bars range.
No matter how competent the Monster is, he will almost always get domed, especially early if we’re talking about the “best” players. Trapper and Support walking together to get a sneak dome.
Ever heard of getting cut off? No matter where you’ll be, they will cut you off and dome in a favorable location. There’s no avoiding domes unless pubs, trigger happy trapper, or a cocky one. Amd lag, of course.
Doming the Monster is one thing, doming in a rare perfect spot is another: especially if the Monster knows the map well.
Hunters are largely limited to doming the Monster wherever they can cut it off.
You also seem to think that Monsters won’t simply avoid the few locations without somewhere to hide.
A Monster that loses the majority of his health in the final fight has had no previous engagements. One or two S2 fights and they have been crippled to a point where they have to relay camp. The Monster would’ve lost some health if he had those previous fights.
To your second statement, so?
Yeah Sunny is good for chasing, but not defensive. Her drone will shield you after getting hit, so just Rt trapper, shield from drone comes on, Fb drone and finish off trapper. Hank is a better defensive support being able to block before any damage and can move. Saving teammates? You mean cloak and revive? Cause every support does that. And you definitely can’t be talking about the shield drone. If it’s the Jpb, then no, because that’s been nerfed and is easy to take care of.
Only if the Monster committed to those earlier fights, in which case it may be more accurate to say that they failed a “final fight” and went in for another.
The typical engagement tactic is to either just evade, try to ambush for a quick strike or two before disengaging, or going all in for the kill.
When I refer to a final fight, I refer to that last, committed tactic.
I don’t know what game you have been playing, but Sunny is great for defense.
The Shield Drone makes focusing and comboing a Hunter much harder, and her Jetpack Beam can and does let Hunters jump out of bad situations.
Well the Monster is also trying to stay alive.
Dodge, just dodge. That’s all I can say.
Well I’ve played a bit of Hunter, and I’m fine dodging, not having any issues.
The hard bit isn’t dodging some abilities, its when the Monster is good and keeps hitting you when your dodge depletes.
To reiterate Monster abilities and mobility come back far faster than Hunter dodges: thus the need for some form of protection against a good Monster.
(Or some cheesy defensive spot, perhaps.)
Then you should’ve reworded this–right here. Also, I said it wasn’t a good tactic, but nowhere did I write that you said that it is, or is not, a good tactic.
Nah, back when Wraith was a squishy glass cannon, any relay fight would rek him.
That did not imply that Relay camping is a good tactic.
You said “This sounds like it encourages camping the relay at the start of the match.”, which was you implying that I was endorsing it.
I’m more more of a Hunter player personally, but I never found winning with Wraith to be difficult aside Defense mode.
Most Wraiths were just terrible and relied on Decoy far too often - Warp Blast and Abduction to focus someone down is better.
That sounds like a bad dome spot. Either that or the Hunters are just bad. Even if the Monster was hiding or fighting them would he have lost more health.
Monster across the map in a few secs? The Hunters can do the same by splitting up and cornering the Monster. The last part made my day. Trappers, or should I say “good” ones can be picky, the better ones will be. They have all the time in Shear, they’re not being hunted.
Though you don’t seem to believe it, most Dome spots have places Monsters can run around and hide if they want to.
You also seem to keep ignoring that good Monsters can avoid bad spots.
I admittedly did not have the the largest maps across their longest sections in min with that, but three quick Traversals can get most Monsters well ahead of the Hunters.
(It is more gradual with Behemoth though, of course.)
You can find those videos or streams yourself.
I’ve watched some pro play, I was simply wondering if you had evidence.
That can be the same if you were Hank or someone else.
If any Monster catches a mistake, he will take advantage.
Yeah, Bucket is good. Maybe a small damage increase. That’s what I love above his turrets, being able to defend an incapped person or just have them everywhere.
Hank and Bucket are rather different in tactics, and Hank is far better at stopping a Monster combo.
Bucket only has the Cloak, Hank can negate a chunk of damage with the Shield and maybe peel with the Orbital.
Bucket pubstomps Monsters who don’t focus well and flail around, but he stuggles against Monsters that know how to combo and focus properly.
The part of the op post that I requoted makes you sound like you do.
No, it doesn’t.
I simply said that Monsters lose most of their health when they are going all-in, and thus defensive play is more important than offense.
Obviously in those scenarios the Monster is on the offense and the Hunters are on defense.
If I was sarcastic, I’d put Kappa at the end of my post. I find a long drawn out match very boring. Also, the part where I said this game is and always will be Hunter favored is definitely not sarcastic or a joke.
Who doesn’t? Besides, they’re all getting buffed.
Earlier engagements are already important for Hunters, do you want to fight a S3 Monster with no health loss?
The game already is about hunting, and fighting will always be here.
Early engagements make little to no difference for the Hunters unless the Monster engages and fights poorly and/or gets outplayed.
You don’t see major swings in games when the Monster is just trying to evade - where they just get hunted to death.
In pro games I’ve watched, most of the time the Monster did not even take health damage until Stage 2: but I’d welcome a link that shows otherwise.
My ideal of Monsters crushing at Stage 3 would come with games being over and decided at Stage 1 on equal occasion, with superior Hunting never giving the Monster a shot at a fair fight.
But again, that is personal preference: for the game to be about Hunting first and fighting as a distant second.
The game is chiefly about fighting well in a defensive stance against the Monsters: hunting is sadly a side note.
That more or less sums up what I’ve seen in pubs and pro games.